Interview #227—Jeff Fatt
by Emma Do
For the ’90s kids who grew up screaming ‘Wake up Jeff!’ at their TV screen, Jeff Fatt needs no introduction.
As a founding member and keyboardist of The Wiggles, the beloved performer spent much of his life entertaining children in his trademark purple skivvy. One of the few Asian faces to grace the Australian mainstream, he toured the country with The Wiggles, recording countless albums and taping TV episodes along the way.
In 2010, Jeff and his fellow Wiggles were appointed members of the Order of Australia for their contribution to the arts.
Jeff spoke to Emma about a life in music, family legacies, and the origins of his sleepy persona.
You officially retired from The Wiggles in 2012. What’s a typical day like for you now?
Look, I’m a typical boomer [laughs]. I don’t do a lot, and I don’t really need that much to satisfy my very simple needs. I wake up, and I have a swim every day. I’ve been going towards having a later breakfast, adopting that 16-hour fasting regime overnight, which I quite like. So that’s my daily routine. But as far as keeping busy, I like tinkering with stuff, fixing stuff up around the house. I play in a band every now and then, probably one and a half times a month. Ironically it’s a rockabilly band, like the very first band I played in back in the ’80s. The rockabilly thing has stuck around.
Is this the same band that you were playing with back then?
No. The band I started then was with my brother, called The Roadmasters. He was on bass, I was on keyboards, and then we had a few other guys. But we were the only Asians in the village, so to speak.
How did The Roadmasters happen?
I’m the sort of person that just follows along with stuff. My brother and some of his mates got together and formed this rockabilly band. I think my brother actually bought a keyboard without me knowing and suggested that I join and play keyboards. And I said, “Oh yeah, why not?” I do tend to get roped into things.
How long did it go for?
He was in it for, like, two years. And then he decided to finish up with the band, going back to Casino to take over the family business. When he left me in Sydney, I was still in the band, so we decided to get someone else to play bass. That band continued on in various different lineups for quite a few years. And I was also playing in other bands at the same time.
Is it true that Anthony Field (the first blue Wiggle) knew of you from going to the Roadmasters shows?
That was my first encounter with Anthony and his brothers. They were still at boarding school then, and they would get out on the weekends and go into the city to see bands. That’s when I first met Anthony, and we’ve been great mates ever since—it’s amazing.
As far as The Wiggles go, it seems that you’re continually doing new projects. There was the Hot Potato documentary in 2023, and before that it was performing at Falls Festival. Does it ever end for you?
I don’t think it will ever end [laughs]. I quite enjoy the diversity of things. I mean, I’m still involved in the management side of things with The Wiggles. And creatively, I might get involved in a recording here and there. If I’m out at the office just to drop by—and they are full-on doing stuff for online content or recording—invariably I end up getting roped into doing some recording or something. So that’s fine, I quite enjoy that.
Take me back to the moment in 1991 when Anthony asked you to come and record a children’s album. What were you doing?
I was happily renovating this old weatherboard cottage—it was a renovator’s delight, so to speak—so I may have been up on the roof or something. I was somewhat rudely interrupted by Anthony’s call. That was the start of those spontaneous things regarding recording with him. When he called me, I asked, “How long is it going to take?” As you know I’m quite willing to go along with anything really. He said [the recording was] probably [going to take] an hour or so, but right now it's taken many decades.
20+ years.
I never paid too much credence to it. It was sort of a continuation of The Cockroaches [the rock band Jeff and Anthony were part of throughout the ’80s]. So that was how I knew him. And it was just him getting his mates or people he knew he could work with, and that’s how it all started.
What did you think of the idea of The Wiggles when Anthony first told you about it?
I mean, when we played in The Cockroaches, I knew he listened to a very diverse range of music. And children’s music was just another one of those things. It was actually from that interest that he decided to study early childhood education to become a preschool teacher, because he thought he’d need something after The Cockroaches finished, because bands don't last forever—usually. And so he did the early childhood course, and that’s when he had the idea to put out an album of children’s music, using what he knew about songwriting with The Cockroaches and putting a modern bent on it. Children’s music was generally very traditional, folky-style music back then.
Do you remember the first song you wrote together for The Wiggles?
I wasn’t involved in the conceptualising of the album, I was just involved in the recording. But probably ‘Rock-A-Bye Your Bear’ was the first of those I heard, and that has turned out to be such a classic song. It is the quintessential song for preschoolers. It embodies everything that they’re all about.
It’s embedded in my brain! I read a quote of yours where you said you felt ‘traumatised’ one of the first times you played in front of kids. How did you get over that fear of performing?
At the time, I never got over it. But once you throw yourself into that situation, you’re there and so you end up powering through it. I mean, I was more in the background of things [anyway], so there was less pressure on me.
I am typically shy, although I guess not as shy as I used to be. Back then, I would question how I ended up playing in front of an audience. My very first band, when I was still in school, was with my brother and his mates. For that band, my brother wanted me to play bass; it was just another one of those things. To a certain extent, you’re not actually showing yourself—you’re performing in this role, so it gives you a bit of cover.
Was performing in front of children uniquely terrifying versus playing to adults?
Not really, because I think I have a good rapport with children. But invariably it was taken over by Anthony, as Anthony’s the guy who steers the show usually. The other two had done the preschool courses too and so they were much more comfortable when it came to communicating with children compared to me.
Was ‘Wake Up Jeff!’ a strategy to deal with the nerves?
That was the perfect strategy. I mean, the ‘wake up’ thing was originally used by Anthony; I think he was the one who was ‘woken up’. But later they saw that the role was much more suited to me, because it enabled me to goof off on stage and not have to do too much. I was always the laidback one, the sleepy one. So that mantle was handed over to me and I quite happily accepted that.
Were you surprised by how much the children loved the bit?
It’s such an empowering command for children to have over an adult, so that was not surprising at all in that sense. But it was surprising due to how it became my thing. ‘Wake Up Jeff!’ will see me to my grave, which I’m quite grateful for.
How often do people recognise you these days?
Now and then, and usually when I’m doing a gig. You’ll have the parents, the grandparents or the teenagers wanting to get a selfie. It’s really nice to know that you’ve been recognised for something they cherish.
I hope the teenagers aren’t still driving by your house and screaming, ‘Wake up, Jeff!’
Not anymore. The new echelon of teenagers would have grown up with ‘Wake Up Lachy’ or someone else.
That’s true, the new person will have to cop it now. I’d like to hear more about your early encounters with music. What role did music play in your life as a child?
I wasn’t totally drawn to it, but it was always in the background. Mum would play piano and piano accordion, in a self-taught sense. But she made all my siblings and I learn the piano. That was in the late ’50s, early ’60s. I went up to grade three and then stopped. To this day, I can’t sight read all that well.
I gravitated more towards playing music by ear. In the ’60s came The Beatles and the onslaught of all that rock and pop music, and that’s what I gravitated towards, as did my brother, and hence how I ended up being in a rock band at school.
In an old interview, your mum says she made you and your siblings practice piano half an hour every morning and half an hour after school, which is pretty relatable for a lot of Asian kids who did classical music. Did playing guitar and bass feel like a rebellious thing for you?
Rebellious… not really. I actually picked up an acoustic guitar, and I was basically self-taught on that. But I didn’t feel all that rebellious, I guess because my brother had already led that charge into alternative music during those days.
How did you feel about piano when you were young?
I can recall when I was doing the grades and stuff. I loved the jazz or blues side of things, so I was always trying to emulate their chord progressions and those styles of music. Then the formal side of learning piano fell into the background and I basically stopped. My three sisters all went up to the final grades. But my brother and myself never went that far. I don’t have the brain capacity to process that sort of stuff.
What other bands did you play in in your youth?
I was in a band called the Clifton Blackadder Blues band. Then there was a band called The Model Husbands—that was an inner-city rock’n’roll type band. There was also a splinter band off The Roadmasters called The Surrey Hillbillies. And then at the same time, because I’d had this interaction with the Field boys, who had their band The Cockroaches, I joined after they asked me [in 1981].
Were you doing music full-time at that point in your life?
Not full-time. It was always still a hobby, but back in those days I had a PA-system hire business—it was my mainstay. That enabled me to dabble in playing in bands at the same time. I’d never considered music to be a profession back then; it has always been a hobby and I guess it still is. It’s become a hobby that I get paid for, which is a nice thing.
I think it’s fair for you to say that it's been your profession.
Oh yeah, [but] only in hindsight.
You joined The Wiggles in your late 30s. When you were younger, what did you imagine your life would be like?
I had no idea. I’d never known what I wanted to do in life. All I did know was that I hated wearing a collar and a tie. I really can’t stand formal clothing on me; my skin is very sensitive to that sort of thing. So in that sense, I found it difficult to imagine myself in a 9-to-5 office job. I’m aware of my creativity, but I don’t consider myself to be extremely creative. I love building stuff and fixing stuff up, and working with my hands, hence the keyboards—it’s all related to what I can apply my hands to.
I did do a course in industrial design. That was a few years after having dropped out of university. I was studying economics, which would have led to an office-style job. But my brain capacity for that is not good, so I dropped out and ended up doing industrial design, which I actually loved. I finished the course but I’ve never actually practiced as a designer. I like the informality of imposing myself design challenges. Design is not just designing furniture or everyday items. Design is actually problem-solving, which I sort of employed in the early days of The Wiggles, in terms of making props and things for the show.
What props were you making?
One of the early props for the show would have been hand puppets. Another thing we used to sell at the shows was the Dorothy the Dinosaur hat. I designed that and that went into a small production run.
Were you the handyman of the band?
Yeah, I was the one who knew how things could be fixed. In the early days when we used to travel around with a suitcase full of cassettes and CDs, I’d set up The Wiggles shop, that sort of thing. I think it comes from my family’s background in retailing.
I was so interested to learn about your family’s store in country New South Wales from your 2021 episode on Who Do You Think You Are?. Was there pressure for you to take over the store, along with your brother?
There would have been an implied pressure, but my brother was much more suited to that. He’s very good when it comes to street-wiseness, business and that sort of thing. Whereas I’m more of a creative.
My parents were quite good in the sense that they didn’t put too much pressure on us, and they were quite happy to see us doing what we enjoyed doing, particularly with the success of The Cockroaches and then The Wiggles. That really drove it home for them, and they were very proud of what I’ve achieved in those.
The Cockroaches did a few Pacific cruises, and so all our parents came on one of the cruises. Mum and Dad were very proud of The Wiggles and were always telling their friends or the hairdresser or whomever.
The Wiggles worked hard touring the world. Before then, when you were part of The Cockroaches, you also toured extensively, playing hundreds of shows across Australia a year. I don’t think bands can do that these days.
No, that whole touring circuit through pubs has disappeared. It was a different time back then. It was fantastic. You’d get to have fun with your mates. You’re playing in these venues every night and then you have the day free. But then it gets to the point where you get older, and you find out you can do without that whole smoky, drinking environment. That was all before the smoking laws, and I’m sure I have lung damage from all of that.
What was it like growing up in Casino in the ‘50s and ‘60s?
I actually loved it. I was born in 1953. Back then in Casino you’d leave your front door unlocked. Compared to these days, things were much easier and safer. We’d play down in the riverbanks after school, swim in the river. The ’50s and ’60s were such a great time to be growing up. And then I juxtapose that with having to work in the family business on the weekends. The kids were always required to work, and so I guess I missed out on those weekends with your mates. But overall it was such a safe and carefree lifestyle in the country.
How old were you when you started working in Kwong Sings, the family shop?
I think I was about six or seven. I recall weighing up lollies, potatoes, flour, that sort of thing. That was when you had to package all your own goods yourself. It was a department store, started in 1929. Back then it sold everything from horseshoes to horseshoe nails to food, cakes—you name it, they sold everything. As for the ’60s, I can recall there was drapery, haberdashery, hardware, manchester, paint, firearms, pretty much everything that a department store has, including a supermarket.
Was it your family who started the store?
It was my grandfather who started it, with my father and his siblings. And Dad would always be relaying the story that he left school at 14 to work for his father.
I imagine you were well-known as the family who ran the local department store…
Actually back then there were, like, four department stores in town, which is amazing for a small country town. But having grown up not being a migrant, it’s a totally different experience, growing up and being part of the furniture so to speak. And so I’d never really experienced any degree of hostile racism. And in kindergarten, kids grow up with you, so you don’t seem any different. There’s no extreme difference. All that sort of stuff is learned when you’re older, I guess.
You’re on record as being pretty shy; you don’t love doing interviews. What motivated you to go on Who Do You Think You Are? and open up about your family history?
I approached that show with a lot of trepidation. The thing that really got me over the line was wanting to find out about my family’s history. You always hear stories from your parents about what happened, but when you’re young you don’t want to know about it. You don’t find it interesting at all. But when you get older and reflect on your life, it becomes more interesting.
What were the major questions you had going into the show?
I really would like to have known more about the European side of my ethnicity, which was the English side. That had always been something that I was fascinated with. I didn’t really know all that much about it growing up. All that we knew was that my grandmother wasn’t full Chinese.
How did the show change your perspective about your family history?
It revealed to me how esteemed my family were in society back in those days. I never realised how big a deal my grandfather on my mum’s side was in Sydney. He was held in high regard because he established what was initially a banana wholesaling business, and from there he became involved with business partners where they set up a steamship company. That was one of the things I never knew about. They also set up department stores back in China, so that was quite a revelation to me too.
I loved seeing those photos of your mum in Hong Kong, dressed to the nines.
In my imagination, it was such a glamorous lifestyle that they were leading. It was sort of like Crazy Rich Asians back in those days. I wish that I could have asked more about that. I would always hear stories from Mum saying how they had servants and all that, but I gave no credence to that at the time. But the show actually proved that what she was saying was actually quite accurate. As a kid, I was very dismissive of it.
I wonder what people thought of your mum seeing her wearing all these beautiful things in a small country town.
She would have brought that whole Hong Kong high-society lifestyle and dress, and she would have stuck out a bit. They certainly would have been quite astounded. There also probably would have been a bit of resentment perhaps, I don’t know. But I think generally our family was held in fairly high regard back then.
And are you still continuing to do family research now?
Not to a great extent. Every time there’s a funeral or family gathering, I will get more details on the relationship within the extended family. But for my immediate family, I’ve got most of that history now. At the moment, I’ve got over 950 names in my database of relationships, with the help of an app. During the days of The Wiggles when we were touring overseas, I’d always be linking up with relatives.
I think a lot of us grew up not wanting to listen to family stories when we were younger. But then we get older and it’s almost too late, and older generations can be tight-lipped about parts of their history. Do you have advice for anyone delving into family history?
Totally, totally. I guess that’s just the nature of human beings. You have to make a conscious decision to do it. It’s not something that you can do when you feel like doing it. Make it a task, a quest to do. Mum wasn’t all that articulate, but you got the sense of what she was talking about.
How does it feel to be an inspiration and important figure to Asian Australians, especially to those who grew up in the ’90s?
I’m very proud of what I’ve achieved in that sense. Before this, I never really paid much attention to that, but I look around and see all these other Asian celebrities, and I am in admiration of what they’ve achieved. So it makes me equally proud to be part of that herd.
Growing up, did you think of yourself as Chinese?
I felt more Australian than Chinese, and that Chinese aspect of things I probably was trying to push into the background. But it was always ongoing because of the immediate family and Mum, who had their stronger ties to Chinese culture, food in particular. I mean, everything revolves around food. But I did feel more European in that sense, still with that reservation of knowing I actually was Chinese.
Why do you think your younger self pushed it away?
I guess it felt a bit uncool. And probably because there weren’t many prominent Chinese celebrities. Now it really helps with self-esteem—it’s all about representation. What you see is what you can be.
It’s changed so much over the years, and you’ve definitely been part of that change.
Yeah, I just happen to be part of the furniture. You never sit down to analyse those things.
You said food was a big part of your family life. Did you inherit any recipes?
We’ve got various old recipe books from Mum. She would always be collecting stuff, such as recipe cuttings from the Women’s Weekly. We have that stuff floating around still. I find it hard to throw stuff out, so there’s a lot of rubbish and junk from my parents.
What do you enjoy cooking?
Well, obviously, your stir-fry type stuff, but my go-to thing is the spaghettini number three. I guess it’s more like an Asian-type noodle. So I’ll do vegetable spaghettini, but I like to use anchovies to start off. You can put anything in it. Spaghetti is like a stir-fry. [Laughs]. I like making mangoes and sticky rice. And I like making sago. I do like my desserts. I am currently on a quest to make the perfect vanilla slice. The pastry’s got to be crispy. The modification I would make is that, instead of having the two layers—the top and the bottom layer—you cut them into little squares, so it’s easier to eat.
I have to ask, how do you feel about the colour purple today?
Ah, I never wear it. Except when I make a special appearance as a Wiggle.
Finally, what does being Asian Australian mean to you?
We’re part of a growing body of people who are continually being accepted in society. I’m very proud that this is the case.
Interview by Emma Do
Photographs by Leah Jing McIntosh at Manly Beach / assisted by Non Chalant